www.ditl.org

I'm not too sure but ER doctors here are known to work 24 hour shifts. Surgeons are a little different in that they have scheduled surgeries and would rotate through being on call. Nurses usually work 12 hour shifts, 3 on 3 off IIRC.

Which is a bad method of doing things. People start to lose focus after eight hours, by ten you've gotten everything out of them they've got to give. By twelve they're just occupying space.

Aye, that does sound pretty bad. Is the US just low on doctors in general? Or is it a case of not wanting to pay for extra staff?

Tsukiyumi wrote:I already conceded that frivolous bullsh*t lawsuits are hurting the entire medical system, but there is no substantial punishment for doctors or nurses who f*cking kill people through negligence. I'm sorry, but that is a serious problem. And it's not just a few people per year.

I certainly never claimed that a blind eye should be turned toward malpractice, or malfeasance in any profession for that matter. All I was saying is that unchecked litigation isn't helping that problem, and is causing another, so why let it go on?

On the matter here is what I think:
- a true demarcation needs to be made to stop demonizing the profession as a whole. It must be made crystal clear that people will be hurt or will die beyond the power of doctors to remedy, and that such circumstances are not a failure of the medical profession, nor are they malpractice. In a similar vein, misdiagnosis of a rare condition which has the same aspect as a common one is not malpractice. It is unfortunate, but not malpractice. Tangential to that fact is that for every medical professional who exhibits the terrible attitude you mention, there are many who act as the complete paragon of what they should be.
- patients need to be freed from the fear of obtaining treatment. If you don't have a well-funded PPO, then you need to worry about pre-certifying for treatment; obtaining a referral from the right type of doctor for the right type of doctor; determining the length of hospitalization, within medical necessity, but sometimes against medical preference; etc. - otherwise, you can get stuck with a bill beyond anyone's ability to pay, and defeating the whole point of having insurance.
- doctors likewise need to be free from taking a patient's coverage into account when making a medical decision.

Sionnach Glic wrote:Aye, that does sound pretty bad. Is the US just low on doctors in general? Or is it a case of not wanting to pay for extra staff?

I personally believe that it is a combination of those, along with the over-specialization of the medical industry. My wife's release from the hospital depended on the sign-off of a surgeon, internist, gastroenterologist, and bariatric surgeon. During her stay, she also was tasked with availing herself of the services of an anesthesiologist, various lab techs and phlebotomists, nurses, nurse's aides, radiological technicians, and a radiologist.

Regarding the link.

First of all that was for medicare, which is notoriously crappy. Back when we were first arguing health care I remember posting something about how medicare treatments and the quality of hospitals primarily taking medicare claims were quite poor. I think VA hospitals were also sub par, which is a shame.

Secondly in that article it mentions stuff like bed sores as a major source of preventable death. That's not even really related to the doctors. That's the orderlies or whatever.

So, at least for a few more months, things should be notably better for younger people on regular insurance.

However that is a seperate issue to my biggest problem with massive malpractice claims, which is how exactly is anything better off when someone collects a gob of cash so the probably not for profit hospital in question can shut down a chunk of a ward or not buy some newer equipment?

I'd support smaller claims that must be paid by the indavidual in question (no insurance option, it'd be more like a very expensive traffic ticket). THough you'd still need insurance to covver medical expenses related to the malpractice, but no more. That would probably be more motivating for them since it's their own money, and would get rid of the crap lawsuits from people looking for gobs of money.

Ah. I see that the forum ate my reply. Them's the breaks.

To sum up, None of that should happen at all. Seriously, if anyone wants more info, ask me to link it. Regardless of whether it's Medicare or not, every study I've seen puts the death toll from easily preventable sh*t at 100,000 a year or so. Way too much, in short.