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ChakatBlackstar wrote:

Mikey wrote:While 0.5 may be the Falcon's "rating," Solo say specifically in ANH that "she'll make .5 past lightspeed." This generally implies "150% of c."

Well Solo isn't that smart either. He tried to use Parsec as a unit of time.

That's how close he was to the Maw blackhole cluster. Meaning the hyperdrive was powerful enough and the navcomputer strong enough to make it through that gravity mishap.

Its the same thing with lasers, .5 past lightspeed, 3 million clone troopers, and a load of other things. I wish people would read Star Wars' EU before thinking their experts on the subject. I look up things on DITL before I make a Trek post many times.

Monroe wrote:

ChakatBlackstar wrote:

Mikey wrote:While 0.5 may be the Falcon's "rating," Solo say specifically in ANH that "she'll make .5 past lightspeed." This generally implies "150% of c."

Well Solo isn't that smart either. He tried to use Parsec as a unit of time.

That's how close he was to the Maw blackhole cluster. Meaning the hyperdrive was powerful enough and the navcomputer strong enough to make it through that gravity mishap.

Its the same thing with lasers, .5 past lightspeed, 3 million clone troopers, and a load of other things. I wish people would read Star Wars' EU before thinking their experts on the subject. I look up things on DITL before I make a Trek post many times.

That's a lame retcon and you know it. Beside the EU is far from consistant. What size was the Executer? 8,000 meters? 12,500? 19,500? Oh and while we're at it, you used the wrong there/their/they're. You were looking for they're.

Actually, when Han says the 12 parsec line, the shooting script says that Obi-Wan has to give some sort of 'incredulous look' or something about that.

And Mikey, just saying what I know, dude. I take SW canon with a metric ton of salt.

ChakatBlackstar wrote:

Monroe wrote: That's how close he was to the Maw blackhole cluster. Meaning the hyperdrive was powerful enough and the navcomputer strong enough to make it through that gravity mishap.

Its the same thing with lasers, .5 past lightspeed, 3 million clone troopers, and a load of other things. I wish people would read Star Wars' EU before thinking their experts on the subject. I look up things on DITL before I make a Trek post many times.

That's a lame retcon and you know it. Beside the EU is far from consistant. What size was the Executer? 8,000 meters? 12,500? 19,500? Oh and while we're at it, you used the wrong there/their/they're. You were looking for they're.

That's the lamest counterpost I've ever seen from you blackstar. And about 19,000 meters. EU got shaken up a bit with the special editions and chaging Boba's background story but it doesn't change every week. Same thing when ENT came out. It shook up the Trek universe.

Monroe wrote:

ChakatBlackstar wrote:

Monroe wrote: That's how close he was to the Maw blackhole cluster. Meaning the hyperdrive was powerful enough and the navcomputer strong enough to make it through that gravity mishap.

Its the same thing with lasers, .5 past lightspeed, 3 million clone troopers, and a load of other things. I wish people would read Star Wars' EU before thinking their experts on the subject. I look up things on DITL before I make a Trek post many times.

That's a lame retcon and you know it. Beside the EU is far from consistant. What size was the Executer? 8,000 meters? 12,500? 19,500? Oh and while we're at it, you used the wrong there/their/they're. You were looking for they're.

That's the lamest counterpost I've ever seen from you blackstar. And about 19,000 meters. EU got shaken up a bit with the special editions and chaging Boba's background story but it doesn't change every week. Same thing when ENT came out. It shook up the Trek universe.

Hey, I have done a lot lamer counterposts then that...wait, that's not a good thing

And ENT didn't shake up the Trek universe. Not anymore then any other series. A few inconsitances, and lousy usage of it's concept maybe, but it didn't misplace a few kilometers. But even you have to admit the amount of retconning and inconsistancys in Star Wars has gotten out of hand. It the main reason why I stopped trying to keep up with the EU. That and the lousy stories. The only really good EU books that I liked was the X-Wing series. Probably because it didn't use the same 10 characters from the movies over and over again.

I also love the X-wing series. Wedge Antilles and the rest of the Fab Four for the win!

Although my heart will always belong to the YJK, EU wise.

ChakatBlackstar wrote: Hey, I have done a lot lamer counterposts then that...wait, that's not a good thing

And ENT didn't shake up the Trek universe. Not anymore then any other series. A few inconsitances, and lousy usage of it's concept maybe, but it didn't misplace a few kilometers. But even you have to admit the amount of retconning and inconsistancys in Star Wars has gotten out of hand. It the main reason why I stopped trying to keep up with the EU. That and the lousy stories. The only really good EU books that I liked was the X-Wing series. Probably because it didn't use the same 10 characters from the movies over and over again.

Well to be honest I haven't read anything post NJO or pre ANH (besides the Han Solo trilogy). I think its bound to happen in any story with multiple writers and not based in every day life. When you make up your own rules for your own universe and have 70 people working on it there's bound to be mistakes.

Its the same thing with lasers, .5 past lightspeed, 3 million clone troopers, and a load of other things. I wish people would read Star Wars' EU before thinking their experts on the subject. I look up things on DITL before I make a Trek post many times.

You expect people to read a rather enormous ocean of what basically amounts to glorified fan fic before having an opinion on Star Wars? Unless the books enormously diverged from the movies, which I do not believe that they did, my personal opinion is that regardless of arguable claims of Wars tech dusting Trek tech in perhaps a few venues, as a general statement the Wars galaxy is a beat-down, run-down, relatively stagnant place where technology is basically used to oppress people (i.e. enormously scaled up weapons and warships) and rarely used in a fair or progressive manner to create a qualify of life for everyone. Most of what normal people seem to be able to use or get their hands on seems to be broken hand me downs, from technology to ships. Given, it is the imperial culture/society which creates this state of affairs more than the scientific aptitude of the Star Wars universe in general; but the flavor of one's culture and society influences scientific advancement and creativity.

The holes you could blast in Star Wars designs, technology, and general implementation of knowledge is at least as large as Trek. And please let's not pretend Lucas sat around with theoretical physicists and such when making up the names and figures for his technologies. Most of it seems pulled out of a hat and slapped together with cheesy 70's/80's prefixes like "turbo" and "super" to make it seem more futuristic and powerful. If Star Wars had not become such a major cultural phenomenon and box office success we'd be writing the franchise off as a generic two-bit hackjob. The loving after-the-fact pedastal placement of Star Wars canon and backstory and technology is largely nostalgic by a bunch of guys who saw the movies when they were 8, 10, 15, and fell in love with the story, not the technological consistency or careful attention to detail. They all wanted to be Skywalker or Solo when they were kids, and they all wanted to be Vader when they were adults (secretly, of course). There is nothing wrong with that but I get tired of what feels like the endless snubbery from Star Wars fans about how everything in SW is so clearly superior to Trek... hell, you can find people out there who go on about what a genius Lucas is and that the Force is a real spirituality. (Not to mention people in Vader costumes getting arrested for assault..) For as much as Trek fans get reduced down to being Klingon costumed convention junkies with no social life, I'd take an hour locked in a room with a Trek fan anyday over many of the fanatical Star Wars fans I've run into. At least Trek fans generally don't view genocidally oppressive evil dictatorships which made Nazi Germany look like funnel cake time at the circus as something supremely cool and awesome.

I don't really care if some made-up, off-the-cuff figure from Lucas about how much firepower goes into a turbolaser emplacement could go through 17 Borg cubes stacked in a row and destroy them all. I like Trek tech better, I think for as unrealistic as it is at times, it achieved a much better feel of "consistently advanced" rather than a hodgepodge of laughably 1970s primitive and super super super powerfully advanced. But whether we think Trek tech or Star Wars tech is better is really neither here nor there. I supposed the real rant here is that the constant subtle hinting that SW is better, its ships are better, its story and writing is better, its tech is better, its villains are better, its realism is better, etc., etc., gets really old.

Duskofdead wrote: You expect people to read a rather enormous ocean of what basically amounts to glorified fan fic before having an opinion on Star Wars?

Books, many comics, and some video games are canon in Wars. If you disagree fine but I'm not arguing a movie only thing.

arguable claims of Wars tech dusting Trek tech in perhaps a few venues, as a general statement the Wars galaxy is a beat-down, run-down, relatively stagnant place where technology is basically used to oppress people (i.e. enormously scaled up weapons and warships) and rarely used in a fair or progressive manner to create a qualify of life for everyone.

I agree with you on this. There's just a difference of opinion on where in technology Wars stagnated. Far as the versus debate that doesn't belong on these forums. (even though there's a fanfic on the website ) So let's speak in general terms. And not so and so can beat so and so. Each universe has things that are debatable, fact, and a bonus or a determent. Transporters, Hyperspace, Death Stars blah blah. I know which universe I believe could defeat which one at the times of movies vs DS9. And I know which one would defeat which one if both universes had 25,000 years to gather technologies. So let's stick to the technical side of the crappy designs

slapped together with cheesy 70's/80's prefixes like "turbo" and "super" to make it seem more futuristic and powerful.

Totally true Super Star Destroyer. Turolaser. Turbolift. Super Sayan. Okay not the last one.

If Star Wars had not become such a major cultural phenomenon and box office success we'd be writing the franchise off as a generic two-bit hackjob. The loving after-the-fact pedastal placement of Star Wars canon and backstory and technology is largely nostalgic by a bunch of guys who saw the movies when they were 8, 10, 15, and fell in love with the story, not the technological consistency or careful attention to detail.

I disagree partially. Much of the technology has been explained in real world ways. Why speeders hover, and what not. Lucas has shown some degree of scientific understanding and prediction. I just watched the Christmas special for the first time last night and omg it sucked but it had TVs that looked like ours. Flat screens It also had a slightly creepy Virtual Reality possible porno... >.> That's just one of the examples but Lucas has done research in some areas of science. Like why the Pod racers have that energy beam. That's based on physics... which surprised me. Ion Engines is based on what at the time was a pretty underground theory for space travel. I'm not saying he's a Michio Kaku but he does put some time into the scientific value of his works.

gets really old.

Then don't rant about it
All I recommended was reading the wookieepedia when you have a question. There's also a 5k page long dicitionary I downloaded a few years back >.> And a 1.3k long time lline.. but that's a bit overkill

Just out of curiousity, are there any really decent SW EU and canon sites where i can pick stuff up. i dont really know that much about SW apart from what i can remember. then again i have a sponge for memory so lol.

If you're looking for a technical analysis site, the Star Wars Technical Commentaries is the best around - it's written by Dr. Curtis Saxton, PhD an Australian astrophysicist.

The Databank on the official site is a good source for most things, albeit lacking detail, and has a "behind the scenes" section for each article.

For everything else, Wookieepedia is a great source, and very detailed, but it is a Wiki, so take unsourced stuff with a pinch of salt.

Thanks. question numero deux: What would you recommend as a decent EU series?

Reliant121 wrote:Thanks. question numero deux: What would you recommend as a decent EU series?

If you're just starting out I would recommend Truce of Bukura. Its a sngle book, not too long, and takes place immediately after the Battle of Endor (like within the week). It introduces some unique races and characters and the good bye of one of the major characters of the saga. Reason I would recommend this over the Heir to the Empire, X-Wing, NJO series all of which I really enjoyed, is because you don't need an enormous amount of SW lore to understand it. Its great for taking baby steps into the universe.

Right, I'm not getting back into the whole Trek V Wars thing, because that'll just get the topic locked (there's a ban on that stuff here, you know), but basicaly a lot of you have the wrong opinion of the tech there, which is very advanced . If someone wishes to take that topic up with me or someone else, create a specific "Star Wars Tech" thread, and leave the VS bits out of it.

Dusk:
No, I would not have a go at a Trek crew for being unable to react in time, as there simply wasn't time.

ChakatBlackstar wrote:
Dusk is right. Wouldn't the ship have some sort of crash avoidance override system? It's a big expensive ship, shouldn't it have some sort of computer override to avoid crashing into other ships, planets, or huge ass space stations? Modern aircraft have a warning system, so it wouldn't be much of a stretch to assume that this type of program could be modified to help avoid a collision.

The Executor's crash avoidance override system didn't activate because of the Force.