Sovereign class

[Mikey]

Exactly. When you do find part of that 90%, there's a chance that there is someone there who doesn't like you. If that someone is more powerful than the Klingons a/o Romulans, then you're SOL if all you've done is prepare "enough" for a Klingon/Romulan threat level.

[Captain Peabody]

Exactly. When you do find part of that 90%, there's a chance that there is someone there who doesn't like you. If that someone is more powerful than the Klingons a/o Romulans, then you're SOL if all you've done is prepare "enough" for a Klingon/Romulan threat level.

Exactly. An effective explorer really has to be able to perform the roles of other, more dedicated vessels. It has to have the Science facilities of a dedicated Science vessel, to analyze all the stuff they come upon, the armament of a Warship, to deal with any threats they encounter. A 'dedicated explorer' is almost by definition a multi-role ship...it has to be flexible enough to deal with almost anything. I it needs to fight a battle, its not going to be in any position to call up some 'dedicated warships' to help it out...it's basically on its own.

[sunnyside]

Where did anyone suggest that the Federation should cease exploring? The point being made was that they should construct purpose-built ships - explorers to explore, science vessels to investigate and warships to fight, instead of trying to combine all the roles into a single package.

Well they currently are, and always have, made vessels with a purpose, take the Oberth. But in the area of deep space operations you do need a ship that is capable of doing everything you mentioned, as well as diplomacy. Otherwise you probably end up with a destroyed ship.
EDIT: Ninja'd by peabody

Now its true that you are always striking some balance between pure military vs exploration. It's just that until recently starfleets focus was heavily on exploration, with their military power largely resting on the fact that they had to heavily arm their exploration vessels.

And it seems to have worked well for them. Imagine if instead of sending out the NX they decided to make a couple warships with much lower warp factors.

Though I will grant that you don't need the families onboard even in long missions. You could just make your personel not have families or not see them for the better part of a decade. But that really really sucks. I'm guessing that's the rational for the Galaxy. Families would rather be together and risk dying together rather than be apart and risk only one partner dying.

Though, to be fair, with the frequency doomsday weapons get pointed at earth your odds of survival on a heavily armed exploration ship vs planetside are debatable.

[Captain Seafort]

Why does an explorer have to do everything? Its task, basically is to head off into space and see what's out there. It doesn't have to do a detailed scientific analysis of everything it runs into - it marks the position of interesting stuff on a map and sends for a science ship. It doesn't have to deal with all threats it runs into - it runs like stink back towards the Federation to warn the military.

[Teaos]

Why does an explorer have to do everything? Its task, basically is to head off into space and see what's out there. It doesn't have to do a detailed scientific analysis of everything it runs into - it marks the position of interesting stuff on a map and sends for a science ship. It doesn't have to deal with all threats it runs into - it runs like stink back towards the Federation to warn the military.

Because it is out in the middle of no where. It has to be able to look at that odd space anomaly or host that summit. Galaxys werent used properly for a number or reasons such as the war. But they were designed to work that way.

[sunnyside]

I agree with Teaos.

Sure if its within reasonably safe Federation space, by all means send a steamrunner around to explore stuff and follow up with Novas as needed.

But when you're out deep you have to be able to do everything or you'll get blown up or miss oportunities.

Of course as technology develops you can try different things. When the Galaxies were commisioned there seemed to be something where the bigger you were the faster you could go. So they were the fastest ships in the fleet, and you might as well max out all the diplomatic and scientific stuff to take advantage of that.

This still seems to be the case if you believe DITL that the Sov is the fastest thing we have.

Also there is something about making first contacts with a ship that's decked out with all the other good stuff. Having the size and firepower makes you less likely to get jumped, having the scientific stuff lets you get in those favorable first contacts where you solve some problem they couldn't, and having proper and impressive diplomatic capabilities help forge the alliances that are letting the federation envelop the Romulan and Klingon empires who DO seem to be focusing more on warships.

[Mikey]

That's all well and good - but then where were the real warships when the times called for battle? The Sovereign wasn't around yet, and the Defiant was only running because it was assigned by coincidence to the station that housed a particular chief who could fix the design. So what happened? You got, as your mainstay ship of the line, an EXPLORER. Yes, it was heavily armed for an explorer - but not heavily armed enough to void the need for a true dedicated warship.

[Captain Seafort]

Because it is out in the middle of no where. It has to be able to look at that odd space anomaly or host that summit. Galaxys werent used properly for a number or reasons such as the war. But they were designed to work that way.

Why? If you want that space anomaly examined, or that summit hosted, make a note of the location and send for a dedicated science or diplomatic vessel. Because of their specialised roles, they'll be far more capable and better equipped than a multi-role ship.

[Teaos]

That's all well and good - but then where were the real warships when the times called for battle?

Akira was around and that is more powerful than the Galaxy. And in large numbers comparitivly. It can take on any of the other major powers ships rather well.

Why Not make a war ship the size of the galaxy that is super powered? Well if we're doing that why not make one a mile long? or five miles? Because it is a waste of resourses and not needed.

Times have changed and starfleet has changed with them having a greater military role and keeping fleets around earth.

But back when the Galaxy was drawn up and build it was the perfect ship for the times. Now not so much.

Why? If you want that space anomaly examined, or that summit hosted, make a note of the location and send for a dedicated science or diplomatic vessel. Because of their specialised roles, they'll be far more capable and better equipped than a multi-role ship.

Thats just wasteful. 3 ships to do the job of one. You want to send a military ship out exploring? That doesnt really project the face the Federation wants to. Having all that stuff on board of the Galaxy looks good. Not only that but it is very funtional.

[Captain Seafort]

Why? If you want that space anomaly examined, or that summit hosted, make a note of the location and send for a dedicated science or diplomatic vessel. Because of their specialised roles, they'll be far more capable and better equipped than a multi-role ship.

Thats just wasteful. 3 ships to do the job of one. You want to send a military ship out exploring? That doesnt really project the face the Federation wants to. Having all that stuff on board of the Galaxy looks good. Not only that but it is very funtional.

No it's three ships to do the job of three ships. I'm not talking about sending military ships out exploring. I'm talking about sending civilian ships out with the specific job of precisely mapping the locations of stars, doing a quick scan to see if there's anything worth investigating further, andthen moving on. If they find a new species, do a quick scan of their technology to see if they're covered by the PD (shouldn't be to difficult), then move on. It's mission would be simply to see what's out there, not to see what's out there, do a detailed scientific survey, carry out major negotiations with the local powers, and defeat any threats to the Federation that it runs into. If a detailed survey is required it sends for a science ship, with the specialised equipment and a crew of experts. If negotiations are required it sends for a diplomatic ship, again with the experts and fitted out for negotiations. If it meets a hostile force it runs. If that hostile force comes after them it shouts for help and a warship comes and helps.

[Teaos]

And where do you get these ships from?

This is deep space exploration not the filling the gaps crap we see Enterprise D do. It could fesably be months maybe even a years travel from the nearest Federation out post. To call for another ship would take ages. The Galaxy can do everything itself, its a floating city.

[Captain Seafort]

Then it takes months/years for the specialist ship to get out to the scene of the anomaly to be investigated/species to talk to. But when it does get there it will be better at it because of its dedicated role.

[Teaos]

The ship would be no better off than the Galaxy would. But that ship is a waste of resourses during the months of transit.

[Captain Seafort]

You might as well say that the warships of the Armilla patrol are a waste of resouces during their transit between home waters and the Persian Gulf. It would be far better than the Galaxy becuase it has a single role, and can therefore be mutch better at that role than any ship that is designed to do multiple roles.

[Teaos]

The Galaxy has the most adavanced science gear around at the time... how do you get better than that?

Going around to Earth to a destination is a bit different than travelling out into the middle of nowhere on a several months long trip to do something that the original ship could do.