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lol, I didn't mean that to sound as dick-headed as it reads. But this is a good example of Hollywood hindsight. There is a romantic aspect attached to the Tommy gun, completely unrelated to its success as a weapon.

It was also the primary automatic of the Marine Corps for WWII. It was a common weapon issued to our allies in Asia. As well as a fav among Paratroopers and Rangers. The fact that it is played up so much MAKES it a notorious weapon.

Outside of that, the IRS, Secret Service and FBI favored the weapon until the MP5 came about. Even then only changed over in order to better work with foreign police forces. Not because they decided the weapon wasn't good enough.

Mikey wrote:Oh, and Deep - it's not a load. If you learn to read, you'll see I said what it's famous for... nothing to do with the quality of the weapon. Out of every 100 average guys, 95 would probably know the Tommy gun best as the gun of Capone-era gangsters.

Right, this is so cute because I of course never read about weapons. Its not like I have an entire life built around conflict in one form or another. God knows those bookshelves are really empty, not covered in bits of paper about this very subject... I get you've got shit going on in your life but you can fuck it off. A weapon is notorious for being known. Read your own quote and figure it out.

Someone mentioned that there are weapons which just "scream" into the history books (or something along those lines), which dredged up a memory I'd like to nominate the JU-87 Stuka as a notorious weapon -- both psychologically and in terms of damage.

Truly notorious for its time. Thats for sure!

Indeed. So iconic that the sound it made - besides instilling fear - became known as the typical sound of any attack plane, even though it was artificial.

Deep - G-d bless you.

First, I apologize for the "learn to read" crack. It was meant in fun, but it obviously stung you so I'm sorry for that. I think the issue here is that you think I'm disagreeing with you about the viability of the Tommy gun. I'm not. It was a great weapon, especially for its time.

Deepcrush wrote:It was also the primary automatic of the Marine Corps for WWII. It was a common weapon issued to our allies in Asia. As well as a fav among Paratroopers and Rangers.

In other words, exactly what I had mentioned. I just added the fact (true) fact that the M3 had replaced it by 1942 in the regular Army.

Deepcrush wrote:Outside of that, the IRS, Secret Service and FBI favored the weapon until the MP5 came about. Even then only changed over in order to better work with foreign police forces. Not because they decided the weapon wasn't good enough.

Yep. Like I said, I never said, hinted, or implied that it wasn't a great weapon. But that usage by the units you mention added to its mystique as a weapon of the Gangland era.

Deepcrush wrote:Right, this is so cute because I of course never read about weapons. Its not like I have an entire life built around conflict in one form or another. God knows those bookshelves are really empty, not covered in bits of paper about this very subject...

Dude, I know for a fact that you have an extensive knowledge of weapons and most things military. Far more than I, I'll readily admit and not be humbled to do so. However, none of that is really germane here. The fact is - and it bears repeating - that I never knocked the Thompson as a weapon. What I said is that the modern fame of the weapon is due to its portrayal in film and television. The average guy on the street does NOT have your knowledge of military history, or your detailed knowledge of firearms. To that Joe Bag-o-donuts, the Thompson is famous because of things like The Untouchables. This does not mean that it wasn't a good gun; it means that the average guy - by whom "fame" is properly measured - doesn't know about all the other stuff.

Deepcrush wrote:I get you've got s**t going on in your life but you can f**k it off.

In fact, we've all got sh*t to deal with. However, I've got a wife with whom I'm madly in love and two incredible children. Anything else is inconsequential compared to that. I know you had a sh*t day at work yesterday, and I again apologize for pushing your button. I know enough teachers to understand that despite your persona, a good day for you means NOT having to put your hands on a kid.

Deepcrush wrote:A weapon is notorious for being known.

And here I thought "notorious" meant "being yellow with pink polka-dots." See above - I agree with the fact that the Tommy gun is widely known; it's just known for different reasons among the bulk of the masses than by the much-smaller number of people with detailed military knowledge.

I asked people yesterday, what they thought of the Tommy. They said, "That machine gun from the movies, right?" And honestly, thats the first thing I think of for it as well.

Just like many kids will think F-22=Starscream, and completely forget that it is the newest (at the time of the movie) fighter jet.

Mikey wrote:lol, I didn't mean that to sound as dick-headed as it reads. But this is a good example of Hollywood hindsight. There is a romantic aspect attached to the Tommy gun, completely unrelated to its success as a weapon.

No problem dude.

When I think of "sub machine gun" i instantly recall the MP40. I don't know, I have just never held much view for the Thompson. Maybe because i've never liked it in video games

The MP40 was certainly iconic in that it influenced a great deal of subsequent SMG design... as did the Sterling. I would say that the difference is that the Thompson (for whatever reason!) became an iconic weapon, not just an iconic SMG.

Iconic sub machines guns would be the Uzi or the HK MP5 for me.

Mikey wrote:The MP40 was certainly iconic in that it influenced a great deal of subsequent SMG design... as did the Sterling. I would say that the difference is that the Thompson (for whatever reason!) became an iconic weapon, not just an iconic SMG.

Given that this is a sci-fi forum, I don't see how you can call the Stirling anything but an iconic weapon.

Ah yes, the Sterling. A weapon that would go off and spin in a circle if you dropped it.

Ouch. Did this happen with the safety on, and was it ever fixed?

Captain Seafort wrote:Ouch. Did this happen with the safety on, and was it ever fixed?

I vaguely recall that it didn't have a safety, when you cocked it, the handle went up into a grove and that was it.

Edit. Wait, yeah it did. And yes it would with the safety on.

Was that because of the imbalance from the side-mounted mag?

Captain Seafort wrote:

Mikey wrote:The MP40 was certainly iconic in that it influenced a great deal of subsequent SMG design... as did the Sterling. I would say that the difference is that the Thompson (for whatever reason!) became an iconic weapon, not just an iconic SMG.

Given that this is a sci-fi forum, I don't see how you can call the Stirling anything but an iconic weapon.

Pretend (:p) that I'm dense... I'm not following, unless you're making a Serling/Sterling joke.