Ukraine

[Teaos]

So I guess we have all been following the news in the Ukraine.

The coverage seems to vary between just another uprising and mildly bloody revolution.

To the start of the next cold war.

With the lattest reports that Russia is dropping in troops to the Crimean peninsula, I think the truth is leaning slightly towards the latter.

I think this may end up being the biggest political event since 9/11.

[Captain Seafort]

I think this may end up being the biggest political event since 9/11.

I doubt it. Biggest since the Arab Spring would be closer to the mark.

[Teaos]

Arab spring didn't count for shit in terms of global politics really. This could be the catalist for a much more wide reaching shift in global politics.

[Captain Seafort]

Arab spring didn't count for shit in terms of global politics really.

Neither did 2001 by the standards of 1989 or 1939, but 2011 brought about the greatest sweep of political change since the end of the Cold War. This one might be remembered as a major shift in US-Russian relations if it goes badly, but I doubt it'll be any more a seminal event in hindsight than Putin's assumption of the Presidency or the Georgian War.

[Teaos]

That would be why I didnt say this is the biggest event since 1939, I said it s the biggest since 2001. Which had a MASSIVE effect on the world. it precipitated events that lead to two wars, massive increases in spying and the erosion of civil liberties, was a firct contributor to the biggest financial disaster since the 1920's and lead to the world opinion switching from "World good guys" to our evil overlords. In terms of a single event, 9/11 may be more important than any single event in the break up of the soviet union.

In decades this could be know as the shot thats heard around the world. But I dont think its going to be quite that bad, I do however, think its an extremely dangerous situation.

[Nutso]

Russians Enter Crimea with Planes, Helicopters, Troops

Russian transport planes and helicopters flew into Crimea on Friday, and a warship blocked Ukrainian coast guard vessels, raising new concerns about military intervention by Moscow.

Armored personnel carriers were seen on the roads and troops secured the main military airport, where more Russians were flying into the autonomous region in southern Ukraine.

Ukraine's U.N. ambassador denounced the border crossing as illegal but said the country, just days after a power shift that ousted Russian-friendly president Viktor Yanukovych, could handle the display of military might.

Of course, Russians have always been in Crimea. Maybe what's about to happen is West Ukraine, East Ukraine?

[sunnyside]

I was a little freaked out when the news was reporting that Russia was giving Ukraine ~24 hours to surrender or they'd start shooting, but that turned out to be a false report.

Now it's more that the US and UK will be shown as unwilling to hold up their end of the treaty where Ukraine gave up their nuclear weapons, and NATO will be shown as generally impotent. That's not going to help with international relations.

Granted it demonstrates that Russia is entirely dishonest regarding their part of the same treaty...but they've also shown they're willing to act for their supporters, and tear you apart if your next to them and don't do what they want. So probably a net political gain...plus probably some territorial gain.

But we'll see.

[Teaos]

Frankly Russia has every right to piss on those treaties, because America broke them from day 1.

When the soviet union split, America and NATO promised not to extend NATO member ship to former soviet states and to not include any members that boarder Russia... yeah, right.

America and NATO has consistently rubbed Russias nose in the fact that they "won" the cold war, provoking a proud people.

Look at the two world wars. First one the allies win and rub Germanys nose in it... 20 years latter Germany bitch slaps them.

World war two the allies win against Japan and Germany, and show compassion to them, help them rebuild and offer finanical, military and politcal aid worth billions. Japan and Germany with in a few decades were wolrd powers and some of America strongest economic and military allies.

Reep what you sow.

[Teaos]

So this ended pretty much exactly like I expected. There was no way Russia was going to back down.

Now with all this shit about them being kicked out of the G8, pointless posturing.

[Tsukiyumi]

Yeah, people seem to keep forgetting that Russia is still serious business. When they want to be, anyways.