Abortion Discussion

[Sionnach Glic]

I noticed that we've never actualy had a discussion on this particular controversial topic. I suggest we remedy that with all due haste.

So, where do we all stand, and why?

[Mikey]

I go with "special circumstances" which fall along religious lines - but ones which I've considered and make sense, and not because I'm just following dogma.

I believe that abortion should be allowed in the cases of rape or incest; and that it should be demanded in a situation in which carrying the pregnancy would endanger the life of the mother.

[Captain Seafort]

It should be legal before the fetus is an individual (i.e. has brain activity of some form) or if the mother's life is in danger.

My gut reaction is to say "never", but that's a personal view, and personal morality shouldn't be legislated.

[IanKennedy]

(snip)...and that it should be demanded in a situation in which carrying the pregnancy would endanger the life of the mother.

What do you mean by demanded? It could mean "available on demand" or it could mean "compulsory". If the latter what if the person doesn't want to do it.

[Tsukiyumi]

Considering the level of overpopulation, I'd say if a person doesn't want a kid, and somehow screwed up (not using protection, birth control, etc), it's their business.

Of course, I dislike it for... personal reasons, but like Seafort said, you shouldn't legislate personal morality.

[Monroe]

I think abortion should not only be legal but it should be encouraged to single low income mothers and young teen mothers. It should be HIGHLY encouraged.

Also I think that people who go on wellfare should be put on mandatory birth control.

[Mikey]

Wait, are we talking about our opinion on abortion itself, or on abortion legislation?

If the former, then Ian - I did mean compulsory. I value an extant human life more than a potential one.

If the latter, then never mind. It's not my business what anyone else does.

[IanKennedy]

I think abortion should not only be legal but it should be encouraged to single low income mothers and young teen mothers. It should be HIGHLY encouraged.

Also I think that people who go on wellfare should be put on mandatory birth control.

Hmm... I'm note sure I can support eugenics.

[IanKennedy]

Wait, are we talking about our opinion on abortion itself, or on abortion legislation?

If the former, then Ian - I did mean compulsory. I value an extant human life more than a potential one.... (snip)

But what if the person does not want the abortion, are you going to force it on them. That is what compulsory means by the way. Think of the psychological damage you could be causing by forcibly removing a potential child from someone because you deem it too dangerous for them to continue the pregnancy. Such things are never entirely cut and dry and the circumstances behind the pregnancy are hard to legislate around. Take, for example, a couple who have been trying for years to have a child. They've tried IVF and have finally, after many attempts, become pregnant. So after all that there's some suggestion that the wife's life is under some risk because of the pregnancy. Say for example she's hospitalized for blood pressure problems, which is quite common and can be a major issue if left untreated. At what point does you compulsory rule kick in? Who's decision is it? The couple? The doctors?

What about the situation where the wife is going to die anyway, say she's been in a car accident and having the child will kill her earlier than if she has the abortion. One way the husband get's nothing, no wife and no child, the other at least he has the child to remember the mother by. Where does you law, or even just your views, stand on that issue?

[Coalition]

The fun part about only allowing it for rape is this:
Man and woman have sex, woman gets pregnant. Woman wants an abortion, but the law only allows it for cases of rape. So she claims the guy raped her, she gets the abortion, and the guy goes to jail and/or gets a sex offender record.

Better option - teach people about sex when growing up so they have all the answers, include at least 4 different options for preventing pregnancy, lots of information, in easy-to-use manual. None of this abstinence only or 'the husband will tell you on the wedding night' junk.

[Tsukiyumi]

...abstinence only...

I love that. One of the world's stupidest concepts.

[Lazar]

I love that. One of the world's stupidest concepts.

I know. It only contradicts a billion freaking years of biology.

[Nutso]

I am personally against abortion.

As far as legislation, it's not a good idea to make abortions illegal. Women will always find ways to have abortions. In the U.S., they did in the time before Roe vs Wade, some with disastrous results. They performed procedures on themselves, or paid a butcher. As long as abortions are legal, there will be real doctors and safe clinics that can perform these procedures safely and with good health care towards the patient.

[Tsukiyumi]

...Women will always find ways to have abortions...

Unfortunately involving coat hangers in many cases.

The issue is troubling to me personally (PM me if you'd like details), but I still believe that people have the right to choose what happens to their bodies.

For example, I am a supporter of assisted suicide.

[Monroe]

I heard abortion rates in Mexico are the same as the United States.

And whats wrong with a little eugenics? I don't understand the bad wrap its gotten when all you have to do is look at a $6k a year household with 5 kids.

edit: Mexico has banned abortion- important bit of info for my line to make sense