The Palin is an idiot thread

[Nutso]

Sarah Palin admits to f**king everyone.

She didn't f*ck me.

[Grundig]

I'm sorry?

[Mikey]

She didn't f*ck me.

Don't worry - if McCain and Palin are elected, we'll all be f*cked.

[Tsukiyumi]

She didn't f*ck me.

Don't worry - if McCain and Palin are elected, we'll all be f*cked.

Yeah, and then they won't even call.

[Nutso]

She didn't f*ck me.

Don't worry - if McCain and Palin are elected, we'll all be f*cked.

Yeah, and then they won't even call.

[Sionnach Glic]

[Captain Seafort]

Don't worry - if McCain and Palin are elected, we'll all be f*cked.

Whereas if Obama's elected Iraq in the sort term, and the west in the longer term will be fucked.

[Grundig]

Yeah... I'm gonna have to go ahead and, sort of... disagree with you there.

[Captain Seafort]

How come? Obama's made no secret of the fact that he wants to get out of Iraq ASAP. It's possible that the Iraqi army might be in a fit state to take overby the time he does that, although unlikely. If not then the country is likely to disintegrate, in practice if not de jure, with the area controlled by local militias, warlords, etc. Rather like the Horn of Africa, or the Pakistani FATA. Guess where AQ's strongest at the moment. Abandoning Iraq before the national army is capable of providing security for the entire country rather than individual provinces would run the strong risk of turning the place into another AQ safe haven, which is thelast thing the west needs at the moment.

[Grundig]

That was meant more as a reference to "Office Space" than a call-out. I'm worried about Iraq's well-being after we pull out too. However, I don't think Obama is going to make an uninformed decision. I don't know that there is a right way out of Iraq, period, but I believe more in Obama's ability figure out the problem than I do in McCain's.

[Captain Seafort]

To put it bluntly I don't trust either of them. McCain, had he simply acted like he has for most of the past eight years, would have been a shoe-in. Unfortunately he's gone off the rails trying to appeal to the far right. Obama I dislike on the ground of this messianic complex he and his supporters have built up - he's a politician, not the Second Coming. Overall I'd rather have someone with an excellent track record but who is (I hope) suffering from election-year insanity than a populist with an apparently belief that running away just as you're winning is a good idea.

[Grundig]

I can't see any clearly-drawn line we'll have to cross in order to say we've 'won.' Iraq's own goverment has started suggesting some sort of draw-down of US forces, haven't they? In any case, I have such low expectations after Dubya, both candidates are looking comparatively awesome. McCain is obviously intelligent and experienced. Palin scares the living hell out of me though, and I really want to keep her and those like her away from DC.

[Captain Seafort]

I can't see any clearly-drawn line we'll have to cross in order to say we've 'won.' Iraq's own goverment has started suggesting some sort of draw-down of US forces, haven't they?

There isn't a specific line. The key to Iraq, as with any counterinsurgency, isn't completely ending the violence, but reducing it to a level manageable by civilian security forces. In the case of the coalition, the point at which a proper withdrawal could realistically begin would be once the Iraqis are in control of day-to-day operations in all provinces. Even then, it would have to be carefully managed, to maintain overwatch support and to be ready to move back in in force if the Iraqis requested it.

[quote[Palin scares the living hell out of me though, and I really want to keep her and those like her away from DC.[/quote]

That idiot is the single serious concern I have about McCain. Her appointment raises serious questions about his judge of character, and raises the spectre of what would happen if he kicked the bucket mid-term.

[Grundig]

I can't see any clearly-drawn line we'll have to cross in order to say we've 'won.' Iraq's own goverment has started suggesting some sort of draw-down of US forces, haven't they?

There isn't a specific line. The key to Iraq, as with any counterinsurgency, isn't completely ending the violence, but reducing it to a level manageable by civilian security forces. In the case of the coalition, the point at which a proper withdrawal could realistically begin would be once the Iraqis are in control of day-to-day operations in all provinces. Even then, it would have to be carefully managed, to maintain overwatch support and to be ready to move back in in force if the Iraqis requested it.

I can accept this explanation. In Iraq's case though, I just don't see how long-term stability and autonomy can be achieved without huge reconciliation between the opposing Iraqi sects. However that ends up happening, our occupation doesn't seem to be a step in that direction.

Palin scares the living hell out of me though, and I really want to keep her and those like her away from DC.

That idiot is the single serious concern I have about McCain. Her appointment raises serious questions about his judge of character, and raises the spectre of what would happen if he kicked the bucket mid-term.

Agreed!

[Captain Seafort]

I can accept this explanation. In Iraq's case though, I just don't see how long-term stability and autonomy can be achieved without huge reconciliation between the opposing Iraqi sects. However that ends up happening, our occupation doesn't seem to be a step in that direction.

Agreed. However, the long-term stability of the country isn't something that can be achieved in the middle of a civil war. Therefore the insurgency has to be gripped before a political solution can be hammered out. Take the Sunni tribes for example. Their insurgency was stopped dead by a combination the surge, a decent wage to help maintain security in Anbar, and AQ outstaying their welcome. Mainly the latter. That couldn't have been achieved without the US presence to act as an intermediary. The next stage is to integrate the militias into the Iraqi security forces - something al-Maliki is dragging his heels on, and needs to be given a clip round the ear for. Al-Sadr poses a similar problem, especially as the Mahdi Army is the largest and best organised militia in the country. Integrating him and his band of thugs into the government and security forces won't be easy.